Bible Students

JACOB: Today we have special guest Noah Sutton the youth director at Calvary Chapel Ballard in Washington today Noah’s going to talk about what discipleship looks like in his context so Noah why don’t you talk a bit about your background and where you’re coming from as a youth director.

NOAH: thanks Jacob um so a little bit of my background is I’m a pastor’s kid I didn’t really expect to be in a position like this and um some of my experience experiences beforehand were uh having to do with being a youth theater I’ve led a few small groups in a church setting and I’ve also ran a few small groups in Bible College um but I think the most formative educational things that I got before getting into this ministry was probably what my dad’s uh youth group small groups that we had during the Sunday Services um where I would just I have like probably seven kids in a room and we just went through chapter by chapter Paul’s Epistles that was really good and that probably set up the way that I teach kids and how I do small groups and a more interactive format of just you know picking their brain but also having them interact with the word of God in a more personal way than regular Sunday service um and then I think some other ones were like educationally the things that I sort of took into my Ministry were um being a dorm Steward in Bible College that that was huge how to counsel people in regular day lives and just being there for the guys and being very personable with them and that was one of them and I think those two were probably like the top two with how to inter interact with people and in hard situations and then also how to teach the word to a point where the kids actually got excited about it so I think those two and then I had of course with you the young adults sort of small group that we had that was for the purpose of getting other people the opportunity to teach that was that was a good time I don’t think it was at beneficial as the other two just because it worked better in the field of ministry I’m in but it was definitely good at practice um talking to people in a large amount um and then of course we I had the Bible college and that was great the youth ministry class was amazing the Bible teaching class was great just both of those classes together really helped me figure out um what the youth looks like uh the goals of doing youth ministry and then just how to get a basic sermon together and just continuing to use that as I just go about teaching in random places so I think those two classes were probably the best besides getting my biblical theology together and Genesis but yeah I think that was probably the most formative things that I did for Bible College and for what I was going for in youth definitely and have you seen classes like um like preaching and teaching or Bible study methods come in handy or mostly just those Hands-On experiences that you’ve had it’s mostly been handon experiences um I mean I’m I try to be studied enough to answer random questions of my kids um it’s not so much deep theology um it’s been really the biggest difficulty I would say is using Clarity for um very complex things to make very simple I think that’s been the biggest struggle and I get your point across when it seems a little bit too complex for maybe the youth kids area of life so I almost think that the those two classes that really helped me in the situation I’m in MH completely but it’s been like the handon experiences to like sort of you know make a lot of mistakes for the sake of seeing what works best so it was a lot of oh I just teach and I would try to just get my three-point sermon across but I didn’t find that very beneficial for my group and if anything I didn’t get much reaction out of out of it so yeah

JACOB: yeah definitely so why don’t you tell us about your contexts um yeah so you’re you’re a youth director at calvary Chapel Washington right

NOAH: yeah um it is Calvary Chapel Ballard and it’s Seattle so it’s very different environment from actually where I’m at currently up more north of Seattle and I’m in Maryville and that’s sort of where I’ve been growing up is this northern part of Washington um but Seattle’s a little bit more south and the culture shift is a bit crazy but Washington’s culture is very um it’s very standoffish I guess you could say I feel like California you could say people are a lot more extroverted more out of their shell they they’ll like make a connection immediately but with washingtonians it takes like it takes time and it takes like a good amount of time commitment consistency is what they appreciate most I think so it’s been interesting in that and uh very I have a I have a very unique youth group in the sense that I might have maybe seven seven kids that are part of the main church that show up for the youth group on Tuesday nights um and then everybody else out of like I think we have about 20 plus kids like in our youth group not everybody shows up consistently but we have about 20 plus and those guys are all from different backgrounds some of them go to different churches or some of them don’t don’t go to church at all so it’s been been a very Evangelical type of Evangelistic based youth group in a sense yeah I feel like you don’t you don’t meet a lot of churches where you have no connection to some of the parents at all besides oh sometimes I have to get that number to tell them that their kids being dumb um but it’s very interesting that aspect yeah so serving at uh serving at that church and you said it’s a culture that’s very standoffish um and that most of your most of your pre Ministry experience uh the most useful stuff was very Hands-On and not very the theoretical um what what are some lessons that you’ve learned through through serving there um well I just feel like there’s way too much that I have learned um that is that’s a fun one so when I started off um I would say like the biggest challenge was trying to work with the youth leaders that were already there that was probably one of the biggest challenges I had um mostly for the sake that they were still trying to do the same stuff that the old guy let them do and there was a weird power shift in um responsibilities of what my youth leaders were doing compared to what I was doing and a good amount of what the responsibility they had was more to be around a youth pastor or a youth director so with me coming in it was one of those things where I was more like having these passive aggressive confrontational things going on between some of the youth leaders and they’re all in high school actually but um one of the things that I’ve heard and I’ve feel like I’m experienced is it’s like so much easier to plant a church or start fresh um than it is to take on the old mantle of the last guy um and I didn’t really see progress in the youth ministry until after um some of these well actually all these youth leaders I started with left and I’m not saying like they were terrible I’m just saying like without a clear Direction and a clear purpose and a goal for the Youth Ministry and responsibilities that were personal to them it’s very hard to go forward and they’re not to be a lot of friction um so that was one of those things that I learned and then also like I feel like a lot of the ministry is not done at the pulpit or in the youth room if you don’t meet with your kids outside of the youth group then I feel like a decent amount of kids go underappreciated and without these personal conversations I feel like it’s even formative for the person that’s doing it because you’re giving them an environment well you’re giving them a conversation outside of the regular environment of youth group that makes it easier for them to see their Faith and Action in every setting you know yeah and just to sit down with a kid and talk to him about life and talking about what’s going on it is it’s probably something they’re not used to like I don’t know how many parents actually sit there kids to the side these days over a meal and just say like how you doing let’s like let’s talk about you talk about your walk with God and um I’ve seen a really good response from that but it definitely took me a little while to get comfortable with the kids well not me get comfortable with the kids but the kids get comfortable with me um but that’s been like super helpful in that aspect and then also I just I’ve noticed I can’t remember what book it was but this was like a really good one actually I guess I have two things of advice or two things that I’ve learned and um one of them had to do with if like you need direction for your ministry like the best thing you can do is just reach your B and pray like if you any direction if you want to like be be like hear God then like just pray read know him and then like things become a little bit more clear over time and then I guess my other one is um one of the biggest things I was discouraged discouraged in is uh I don’t feel like my youth group when I started was in a very good place like spiritually if I asked like my kids when I started like what the gospel was and like what that meant for them it was um it wasn’t incorrect but it was a very shallow representation and you could just tell like some of these kids just could could not believe what was given to them and so we’ve been doing like a bit more of a deep dive into some stuff but the thing there is you know knowing your sheep giving them what they need but also not trying to like force a fruitful season like I feel like it’s constant repetition and sometimes in youth ministry you want to see the results now the fruit now but it’s not really how it works I actually had a guy come up to me and tell me like expect fruit out of your youth ministry in like in five years like you have to be committed to this for five years to see anything actually really happen like to see the stuff you want to happen happen so it’s been an encouraging thing to like take things a little bit more slowly but not like in a way to be lazy but to see like slow progressions okay if it’s actually leading somewhere

JACOB: Yeah so you had mentioned uh something about passing vision for your youth group um and how if you want to know where the Lord is leading you just be in the word and and get to know him more um how how have you been casting Vision or directing the mission of your youth group what what have you found has been helpful in that and what have you found to be kind of a waste of time what are things that are not helpful in that

NOAH: okay um sort of trying to figure out the Vision stuff um I I think of weirdly um I actually just went over this passage yesterday um in First Corinthians nine where it talks about like practically Paul meeting people where they’re at like he was a person to everyone and um interacting with my kids and then also reading the scriptures I’m just like I have truth in my hand to combat what these kids are dealing with and I’m not trying to like you know psycho and um take them apart mentally in any way or psychoanalyze but I’m trying to I guess be more sensitive to the spirit where he’s leading in that way and being like hey this is a need um but this is also your answer and then I’m going to use this um and then with vision stuff and like test runs and all this stuff like I remember one time I thought it was a really good idea to like if the kids don’t feel comfortable with confession to get no cards out and have them write down what they struggle with and then like we just put those in a box and we pray for that stuff um that was that did not work at well at all um the kids actually were confused throughout the whole thing and um they didn’t feel comfortable doing it and from now I’m like yeah I understand like that was not probably the best situation especially like the guys were just close together and they were like heck I don’t think half the kids even knew like what was sinful in their lives you know um I did that small groups have been one of those things that I’ve been trying to get to work better but it it really depends I feel like on your group and like where you’re at because I’ve had like some wildly unproductive small groups which I wish I didn’t but because of the group and the way that kids like intermix with each other like that is that’s hard because you’re going in with like a certain purpose of hey we’re going to talk about a subject this isn’t really I mean it’s good to catch up on people’s lives you know it’s great but sometimes with the small group setting um especially if you don’t have enough time I want to dig into the topics that we have so like the kids can actually grasp what’s going on you know like what I just taught might not have resonated very well but like interacting with it um asking deeper questions of why and what this means for you and what does it look like practically that’s what I’ve been trying to get across you know and I mean in our youth ministry class I think our teacher did us like the best um favor with just telling us like these kids are questioning who they are in every way and I feel like even in adulthood people ask the same questions but it’s not as general now as much as you know small aspects of life um but yeah casting Vision I’ve been failing with a lot of test trial runs especially with events because events are just rough they can be like really good turnouts or they can be really bad turnouts that g like went all out you know so it’s it’s interesting to see like what hits the kids what they’re interested in and then with sermon prep it’s more like I’m leaving stuff at the podium half the time where it’s like hey I feel good about that might not have been the best thing that I’ve taught but I feel good about that and I feel like the kids resonated with some of that you know

JACOB: yeah uh on that on that subject of teaching you had mentioned how uh a lot of the growth that you’ve seen or a lot of the effectiveness comes from you living life with the kids um so tell me about that how do you how do you live life with with your kids

NOAH: um so I have like about two kids four or five kids that show up for like regular Sunday service and I like sitting with those guys I like being pretty updated on their lives um I also have a few kids that I meet up with outside of the youth group and um for some reason there’s been like a heavy thing in my heart work I want to meet up with the kids have already graduated because I want to make sure like they’re still taking care of I don’t see him as oh you grew out of the nest it’s more like I want to make sure you’re still like walking and walking well um I also just every time I have a free day I hit up a few different people and I’m just like hey you want to grab coffee you want to talk about a few things that’s been nice um it’s been interesting though because I’m like I’m pretty I try to be as vulnerable as possible and I also try to be as transparent as possible because I don’t want to be like Oh I’m going to teach at you when we’re outside of the pulpit um and I feel like some my kids actually view me that way because um I can’t shut up about certain things you know when you’re when your world view is so bent towards a different way biblically you can’t help but see things as wow this is a sinful world just in the name need of Jesus you know um but with meeting kids um I try to meet more than once you know even if it’s like wildly awkward the first time because I’ve noticed with one of the kids that I’ve met with probably like four times and then like a few times outside of youth group for certain events he just started opening up about stuff that like I had no idea what was going on in his life and I don’t feel like I would have ever gotten to that place if I didn’t go through all the awkward phases you know of just I just bought you a meal um we’re sort of talking about what you’re interested in and then it’s just you know feels like just trying to fill space not so much like have a productive conversation I feel like we just got to that point where like oh we’re having a good conversation about just what you’re dealing with in life finally you know so that’s been an interesting thing and actually it’s one of her mutual friends Sunni that brought that up with wow we we have to go through like even the most awkward phases with some these kids because they’re awkward I mean people are awkward but like kids especially they’re so awkward yeah

JACOB: yeah you had also mentioned that your group was having a hard time with understanding and articulating the gospel in the beginning um so what what did you do from that like where where did you go to grow that quality of being able to articulate the gospel in your group

NOAH: so I’m still working on that like that’s actually a new uh theories that I started with evangelism so this last few weeks I did um the implications of Jesus like from the Virgin birth to why he came to the way he lived to the way he died to the way he resurrected you know um I try to talk as much about the Deep implications of what that meant for us and then like the next series I mean the next teaching was um Justified made righteous and then this walk that we have which is sanctification leading up to glorification and then this last actually yesterday we went over um what it looks like to be an evangelist um and sort of try to build up to that you know so it’s been it’s been a very crazy work in progress because I feel like whenever you’re trying to talk about the grace of God and how he’s made you righteous and it has nothing to do with you it’s like a hard concept to grasp especially for kids who are still trying to work their faith for the sake of their salvation you know like they don’t see it as oh I have a relationship with God as much as I just did all the right things today you know M and uh I think there’s also like that thing where we’ve done a really bad job of representing what the gospel is um showing what the gospel is and also um we haven’t really told them like what it takes you know so I’m trying to more put him in this aspect of this is a hard thing to grasp because yes Jesus loves you but he doesn’t like wish for you to stay the same you know I feel like he he loves us he loves us uniquely he made us but for us to think it’s okay to continue in the way that we’re living I don’t think that he has that calling for us he Jesus God loves us and he’s calling us to him and he’s calling us to greater things that we even would even we can’t even wish for ourselves and um when we come to Salvation and saying hey I’m not enough but you’re enough and I want you to guide me in this and usually the alter call Vibe is oh that guy could get me out of hell and that’s pretty much it but we don’t see it as I’m lost I need guidance I can’t save myself and I’m G to give everything up for the person that created me for the person that knows me best and literally it’s just a complete win-win situation but we take it as oh I uh I’m out of hell now and I guess I can talk to this guy up in the clouds and um I guess I have to do the right things now it’s more like no I just want to do what God wants for me because the stuff I was doing beforehand actually did more damage than I would like to admit so I’m trying to I’m this next series is going to be on humility it’s going to be on who God is and who are we in light of who he is so to truly understand ourselves I feel like we have to understand God and to really have relationships that are deep with others we need to understand our relationship with

JACOB: yeah for sure you had also mentioned you had previous youth experience and that you were a dorm Steward at bible college how do you see those things playing in what what lessons did you learn through those experiences that you’ve been able to apply now

NOAH: so when I was doing like the when I was doing youth ministry and my dad’s church I was also doing youth ministry in Calvary Chapel Lake stud which is actually G super far away from where I live right now my sister actually attends there now actually all my family does I think and what I got out of those was I I didn’t teach classically where it’s like I had these three point sermon I was trying to make these points it was more like I know my points like I I studied I took my notes I know where I’m going with this um what I did though is I’d read probably like the most um key verse out of the scripture I was going through and then just try to have the kids sort of take it apart or redefine the words not in a way that it would like take it out of context but for it to be easily grafted for them you know so i’ be like hey what is love like what ways have you seen love like if I was talking about 1 Corinthians 13 and then sort of just go into like deeper um implications but have them defined have them give me examples and for the sake of me even being like Oh but I don’t think that’s right I actually had one dude uh I remember when I was talking about the Trinity with a group of kids at my old church and some one of the kids was like I asked him like did did God me to make you and he said yeah and I’m like no he didn’t and he’s like what do you mean and so we actually sort of took that apart and talked about the like the self-sufficiency of the Triune God you know but it’s interesting because I feel like kids need to be told no and need a correction of their thoughts or kids really need to like externally process what they’ve been taught for the sake of their deeper growth because if they don’t even understand what they’re taught and it’s just a fact in their heads that how they practice anything um and then in dorm group life living with guys um day to day and like they see your lowest and you see their lowest but like there’s some nice thing in there where you acknowledge hey I’m just a guy and I’m trying to follow Jesus just like you and uh we just got to be U we got to be honest and we got to be vulnerable with where we’re at but also like um living with other guys in the dorm gave me a really nice opportunity and privilege just to go deeper with the dudes um just talk for hours about whatever is going on and just try to get stuff processed out you know and then just point him towards Jesus you know like one of the guys that I was talking to I guess I don’t know if I’d say intentionally discipling because I don’t think you would even call that um what that was but it was a good friendship in the way that I try to point out truth and he would not receive it but it was one of those interesting things that I know that the guy’s gotten like so much more fruit in his life and I wasn’t part of that but I was I was a part of the beginning of that you know like I feel like I planted seeds and to bring that lesson in these Ministry where it’s like hey I planted seeds but maybe I’m not going to see like the full grow grow in the Harvest of this you know but like I’m just trusting in God with what I did and I hope that I did it well you know

JACOB: mhm it it seems like a lot of your a lot of the lessons that you’ve learned and a lot of the experience that you’ve had has been mostly geared towards just being Hands-On and making mistakes and learning what what doesn’t work um do you feel like that’s true do you feel like a lot of your experience has shown you what doesn’t work and for someone else who’s just starting out like is that some advice that you would give is to just get hands on and and learn what doesn’t work

NOAH: yeah I mean this is this is an interesting thing with my situation that’s pretty unique is my pastor he’s more like hey what are you gonna do and I’ll give him like a very basic outline of like the way I would run youth ministry and stuff but it’s more like he gave me full Range man like do it the way you want to do it this is sort of like it’s not my thing it’s God’s thing but it is me being used by God and that’s going to be looking pretty unique in the way that I lead and dude he gave me full range but I also made like some I made a lot of mistakes going through and it had to do more with relationally with leaders it had to go do with um you know setting up small group setting up teaching doing all these things dude the next thing about mistakes is sometimes like the consequences of them they make you remember hey like I’m not going to do that again because that had a terrible reaction you know yeah but also like with just testing the water on a few things um even in the mistakes you can see something really nice come out of even like the things you didn’t expect to go the way that they did you know um like I did a confession night and I wasn’t expecting anything out of that I was just going off of a Lim I was just like I want these kids to confess what’s going on like what sin they’re dealing with that’s been done to them that they’re doing that whatever and the kids actually responded and they responded that they responded really well for the first night like I’ve ever seen and uh it was one of those things where wow these kids I would have never done that I would have never thought that would be beneficial but you sort of have to like put some risks out there and see what happens you know but it’s one of those interesting things where like I have a lot of things that I want to do but you also have to like test the waters on your group like sometimes they’re so hit or miss and you’re like oh this is going to be so beneficial for the group like what if we did a question and answer night and uh the kids hate that stuff they could care less I don’t think they have a question even like made up in their head right now and if they do it’s more like oh it’s gonna be that one kid and they’re going to talk to me after service no matter what you know but yeah there’s some things that I want to do my group does not want to do and I sort of have to just read the real on that

JACOB: yeah and any other advice you give to someone who’s just starting out or advice that you would want to have heard when you were just starting out all the way back in Bible College

NOAH: I still when I I when I left Bible College I I was given this opportunity to take over as the youth pastor thing and that was an interesting season because I still felt like I needed more time at the college for the sake of my personal growth and my intentionality and um then I remember our president of the school being more like hey your time here is over type of thing like you should do actual Ministry and dude I didn’t think of myself equipped for Ministry I just knew that the Lord was calling me in this direction and um I don’t think I would have learned the stuff I’ve learned from youth ministry at bible college um it’s a nice space like Bible College is like the perfect space to be truly intentional and to practice and I I did that to an extent at bible college I don’t know if I did it like the way I fully wanted to you know but it was a nice space but SHO I feel like people want the title of a minister but they’re not willing to actually put in the work of a minister with everything that it implies you know and that’s sort of where my I don’t believe I was there where it was like oh I just want the title it was more like I didn’t really want this but I felt like the Lord’s hand heavily pushing in this direction and uh I don’t think you should ever search for the title because I feel like all this stuff is calling but I think what you should do in prepping for Ministry is really like evaluate your life in the midst of knowing who God is you know like there are unintentional sins that we deal with that affect us and affect others and we need to really like dig deep and figure out who God is like it has to be this Pursuit Of God with no alternative motivation but to pursue him you know like we have to see him as no he is literally everything like everything else in comparison is nothing and I feel like sometimes we get distracted by the things that he’s made and it could even be like a romantic situation or whatever but there’s comfort in having a relationship deeper with God and then going into a leadership position because you can be transparent with no fear you know I know who I am in the midst of God I am still a sinner I still mess up like if you’re trying to bring out my old sins to like dry out hey that doesn’t have a hold on me like it used to you know and that’s nice to say confidently where it’s like I feel like a lot of people want to get on Church leadership and people feel ill equipped and people don’t feel confident but it’s like I’m submitting to a work that God’s doing yes I’m not a perfect thing I’m also not saying like I’m doing like heinous crimes or anything that like could turn a blind eye but I am I’m trying my best and I’m calling brothers and sisters to grab hands with me as we pursue this throne and I’m not discipling kids for the sake of making them more like me but for the sake of they can have a better footing and maybe even run past me in this race you know because now they’re learning from my mistakes you know um yeah man I had a huge thing I think with confidence and self value of speaking on this leadership position of who am I because I was also dealing with I’m a pastor son I don’t want to be walking exactly how my dad did but I also had to take like um I had take everything with a grain of salt knowing hey not everything that my dad has done I should like try to throw out because I’m very much like my dad anyways and also like I needed to know where my value was in the midst of who God you know um I had to seen myself as an imperfect thing but like that just emphasizing emphasizes and highlight my need for God even more and how like with me laying down my own life is actually the best thing for me because what I do isn’t good for me you know but yeah that’s probably what I’d say to the young guy besides like God loves you be beyond what you think you know he has Grace for you beyond your imagination because yeah I know that guy was like dealing with a bunch of problems with the calling to Ministry

JACOB: yeah for sure well thank you Noah this has been really good I appreciate you calling and doing this interview so thank you

NOAH: no problem