Bible Students

JACOB: this episode we have special guest Emma Eelkema one of the two children’s ministry assistants at the Garden Fellowship today she’s going to be talking a bit about what living like a great commissioned Christian looks like in children’s ministry so Emma why don’t you begin by talking a bit about your background

EMMA: all right so my background I was basically born in church and was brought on as a volunteer just as a baby because my mom was a children’s ministry director as a high school student I started helping out Tuesday Mornings um with this little bible study group and I’d watch over three-year-olds and it was super fun super awesome I loved it um later on I ended up going to Bible college and that is where I got a lot of knowledge about Ministry and really had the call to Ministry um I ended up coming back from Bible college for summer break and summer of 2022 I think and was an inter turn uh for the children’s ministry the garden fellowship and after that I went back to the Bible College I graduate in 12 days with a bachelor’s degree in biblical studies with an emphasis in Christian leadership uh and then after that I just continue to do what I’m doing at the Garden as a full-time vocational Ministry worker in the children’s ministry

JACOB: awesome so you interned for the garden Fellowship in the children’s ministry as well correct correct can you tell me a bit about that

EMMA: so I was I came on as an intern um and they had this super small internship program it was basically kids who were raised in the church uh just continuing to do what the Lord had called them and was equipping them to do so we were all in different areas um mine specifically I was with all the little kids and I was focused in the elementary Department of the church so I would basically call the kids out of their classrooms for their big group time I would do announcements with them sing Happy Birthday to the birthday kids introduce the new kids I would help print their labels clean classrooms sharpen pencils um help volunteers know what to do where they’re going take care of disciplinary issues uh step into teach every once in a while so interning isn’t super different than the work that I’m doing now um but when I was an intern I was with Elementary School students and now I’m more with like early childhood babies awesome what was it like to teach as an intern scary uh the first time I taught I did the Abraham and Isaac story and being a bible college kid I’m like yeah so this guy brought his 30-year-old kid up to kill him as a sacrifice so it was really weird to try and transition from like talking to 20-year-old Bible college students about the same topics to speaking to like seven year-olds about that so it was very intimidating and I was very very timid um but it was a super great experience and just showed me that I love to teach kids and I love to present the gospel and the Lord to them so that way they can just grow in their faith and in their knowledge of scripture

JACOB: I imagine that dealing with disciplinary issues as an intern was pretty intimidating as well

EMMA: it it definitely was thankfully there’s a super great team and so the more the major disciplinary issues were not falling on me um I was mostly like hey you guys you’re being disrespectful to your teachers let’s quiet down let’s remember what listening is like um but there were times where I was like okay we don’t crawl under the bathroom stalls cuz that’s inappropriate behavior um but with younger siblings and stuff it wasn’t like terrible cuz I was used to getting on their case anyways you said that you also dealt with volunteers do you have a big volunteer here group um we we do so our church is is really large we have um just over 300 kids on a Sunday so our volunteers we have about 100 coming in and out which is super great

JACOB: yeah definitely what was it like as an intern to interact with those volunteers

EMMA: it was super weird but super sweet because they were able to acknowledge my position and respect me for it um but it was definitely strange being a very young woman directing older men um and women the men were a lot more receptive cuz they just were like okay this is your area but the women were like no we got to do it this way I was like okay no so that it was a very common thing for me to get my boss and be like okay we got to help this person out again

JACOB: yeah definitely have you uh worked with kids before

EMMA: I have um so before I got hired on at the Garden I was obviously an intern for them um I was in children’s ministry a ton I would babysit just on the weekends um but then when I first came back home from Bible College I was a nanny which was super super sweet I loved it uh and then I started working at a different Church uh in the evenings to help out with their Child Care Program it was basically like as the parents were getting fed the kids um were just watched over and kept safe um and so it was super sweet to be able to pour into them

JACOB: for sure so why don’t you tell me a bit about your current situation so you’re no longer an intern at the Garden Fellowship you are now

EMMA: I’m full-time staff awesome so you are one of the two assistant in the children’s ministry that’s correct yep yeah so with two assistants we have one that covers Elementary and one that covers Early Childhood we have like 13 classrooms I think it is um and then with 300 kids it’s just it’s so much for one person to take on that it’s really helpful with two different assistants uh who are able to cover completely different things cuz being with a fifth a fifth grader so like a 10 11y old is very different than being with a 2-year-old you know there are different life problems there’s different like boundaries so it’s it’s super nice to be able to have two people to kind of tag team it and so with where I’m at right now I hope the little kiddos so anyone who’s fresh out of the womb to about six years old not in first grade yet um I will like help their volunteers kind of know what to do I take kids to the bathroom change diapers that’s not the most exciting thing ever but it’s it needs to be done um I do all their printing uh I help teach them sometimes uh do worship with them with them I do a lot of I do a lot more disciplinary stuff it’s definitely interesting with three year olds um they’re super great though so it’s it’s super fun just watching over kiddos yeah and you currently attend Bible College correct I do so I should be done within the next 12 days mhm what has it been like balancing working full-time at the church and also doing Bible College it’s it’s been a lot not going to lie um it’s also it’s been difficult for me I’ve had to seek the Lord in this um to be able to keep going because I’m like okay God like you have provided my like dream Ministry job you’ve provided what you’ve called me to why do I need to finish this degree and so remembering that he’s called me to Bible College very specifically and knowing that I should be faithful to that call um to just practice discipline honestly has been very important and has been something that I’ve had to pray through a lot um but it’s it’s tested me as you have to make so much time and you really have to you know your work schedule um which is constantly changing because you’re in Ministry but uh that school schedule too it’s it’s so much and this is the largest amount of credits that I’ve ever taken which I would never want to do again I’m taking 30 credits so 11 classes um and it was honestly super hard to balance out and I cannot wait for it to be done but it’s also been super rewarding I’ve been able to immediately apply things from class to work um and a big thing that I’ve learned is as soon as I clock out I have that like half hour drive home to kind of debrief and pray and then I come home and I eat a snack or something cuz it’s been a long day and then work brain kind of turns off I don’t let myself focus and meditate on the things throughout the day um unless it’s strictly to just pray and give something to God um but I let that be that and then I come home and I’m like okay I’m a student now and I’m ready to put on my like academic cap and just focus on early childhood development or whatever I’m working on that afternoon

JACOB: yeah so attending Calvary Chapel Bible College have there been any classes that have stuck out uh that have been especially helpful for your current context

EMMA: there have been I took an introduction to youth ministry class which was super helpful was with Andrew Paulson um definitely one of my favorite professors that I’ve had he was super great um but youth ministry is super different than children’s ministry but a lot of the like discipleship methods are the same um you just kind of have to cater it to whatever age group you’re working with um that one was super great our my homiletics class which I didn’t originally like the professor was kind of stubborn um I ended up immediately implementing as I was a Tuesday night teacher and it was really helpful to have different teaching methods and to know like okay this is what the spirit is this is what the specific book means because I brought the kids through the gospel and so having that gospel message kind of mastered uh throughout Bible College and throughout the different classes I’ve taken was also super helpful

JACOB: definitely so did you end up having any sort of practical Hands-On classes um at the Bible College that were helpful for this job

EMMA: not that I can think of right off of my head I was part of a a servant Hood class where you went to different seminars and so you got to learn kind of like how the church works and like what effective Ministry looks like constantly throughout Bible College you’re learning how to be a servant how to serve others um with that servant Hood class I was a part of the school’s AV team um and I’m able to do a lot of random AV stuff that we have now because our children’s ministry building is separate than our main worship center and so having someone with slight AV knowledge or audio visual knowledge is super helpful and super practical whether that be uploading slides taking care of dead mics being able to raise volume turn the TVs on um working with the iPads and stuff it’s super practical to have that um I was also a dorm student Steward and so what a dorm Steward is is at the Bible College um instead of having like an RA we have dorm stewards in almost every room the Bible College is super small it’s like 80 to 100 students and so being a dorm Steward is a super sweet intimate experience where you get to just take care of and disciple and come alongside of and encourage um like eight people and just pour into them throughout that semester and so being able to learn how to disciple while also being discipled at bible college was super helpful to what I’m doing now as I’m discipling kids and volunteers and parents

JACOB: definitely what do you think some of the similarities and differences are between um living life and discipling individuals who are you know 18 19 20 years old your age yeah um and discipleing people who are 9 years old all the way down to to too

EMMA: yeah it’s it’s not as different as I thought it would be um because I feel like the purpose of discipleship is really just to come alongside of people and to meet them where they’re at and to just point them to the Lord discipleship is not about you in any way shape or form it’s about like the person and helping them draw closer to the Lord and you just get to be that vessel whether that be like showing them during scripture whether that be list listening to them praying with them or like helping them be distracted from what’s going on in life um so discipling my dorm girls who were my age or older than me um I was able to come alongside of them and in their trials which were similar to mine as we’re both enduring classes as we’re going through a blizzard as we’re just doing life together um so it was a bit easier as I could like walk through through it in the sense of like okay going through this with you as we’re living together but obviously I’m not living with all 300 students that we have um and I don’t know all their home life situations and so being able to just sit down and listen to a kid is is the sweetest thing ever and I I had an experience with a girl who we do at our church and she just was a brand new kid it was her first week she was super nervous so I like helped walk her to her classroom introduced her to a couple girls and she came to me during their game time and she’s like I can’t play the games and I was like no you can’t you’re wearing Crocs and those are not sport shoes and so she stood out and I was like just trying to get to know her a little bit and she started telling me about school and how she was switching schools and just a ton of super heavy family stuff and it’s just things that a 9-year-old should not have to deal with um I feel like so often people forget that kids endure the same trials adults do but they have a lot less experience than adults and so they’re trying to figure everything out on their own they’re scared they can’t go to their parents CU they know that their parents are going through stuff they don’t know how to process anything and so being able to just sit down and listen to a kid and hug them and hold them and allow them to cry and then just show them like hey I know that this is super hard but I’m here and I love you and there’s a super cool guy named Jesus and he loves you a ton and so being able to present the gospel to those kids in those times but just discipleship is about loving people loving people the way Christ would have and so it translates to any age group

JACOB: yeah and I think when a lot of people look at Children’s Ministry they think that the kids are just going to be crazy Little Devils they are and I think a lot of people Miss like what you were saying the opportunity to minister to a child that even though they are a child they’re still someone who’s able to respond to the gospel there’s still someone who goes through suffering and like what you were saying those two things go hand in hand a child who’s going through suffering can can just as easily if not easier than an adult he’s shown the gospel and be led to that yeah I definitely get what you’re talking about um and so you were talking about teaching kids so like you were saying you’re a dorm Steward you’ve taken homiletics what would you say are some of the major differences between teaching an adult and teaching a child

EMMA: the attention span I was our Tuesday night bible study leader for the kids and so I had maybe 35 kiddos come and we divided them by age um so we had our new like our our babies all in one room and then everyone from the ages of 2 to six in a room and then all of our first through fifth graders in one room and it was chaos it was so bad in all honesty because the kids just could not listen and so me and one of my co-workers we were just praying through it and I look at her and I said I don’t mean to be Sexes but we need to divide these kids by their gender and she was like okay that is that even a good idea I was like let’s try it for one week and let’s see what happens and so we divide the kids up they’re pretty confused so we were able to explain to them what discipleship was what our hearts behind dividing them was and I just told the kids I said you know what to my girls who were actually on the lesson I said the boys can handle a three-minute lesson and you girls can handle a 30 minute lesson all the boys do is play games and those games teach them about Jesus and the things that we learned about but you guys have this like drive and passion to learn and you both both boys and girls tend to learn differently every individual learns differently but just for this situation that’s that’s how it worked out and so being able to teach the girls like we all need something different and this is how we can cater to those needs was really awesome so I would go into the boys room and seriously I would let’s just take the seven days of creation we we did the creation lesson and these guys they sat there kind of one of them just kind of hovered in his seat the other kind of ran around um but most of the guys could sit and listen um and some of them comprehended it but they were able to get the lesson through Seven Corners where we took each day of creation and turned it into a sign and just had them choose a day to stand in and someone would pick a day and whoever day that was they were out um they were so chaotic one of them looks at me and goes I was telling them about the fall are your pants on backwards I was like that has nothing to do with this lesson what are you talking about and so just catering to the kids and meeting them where they’re at is so important um so with the guys it was just like learning through experience Hands-On games um but with those girls I was able to come to them and just explain things I don’t want to say dumb it down because they kids aren’t dumb they just don’t have the same amount of knowledge as adults do and that totally makes sense like I’m not going to come to the Cheerio and be like let’s talk about God’s omnipresence cuz like they can understand the word water and that’s pretty much it they know Cheerios really well but like I can’t come to them and just say omnipresence because they just haven’t learned that yet and so being able to come to the girls and be like okay this is what special Revelation is and to just be like that means that God God wrote the Bible like he inspired it um and was able to reveal parts of himself so it’s like when you’re revealing you’re coming out of hiding like you’re making yourself known you’re making yourself seen and so just catering to the needs of the kids that you’re around like adults you have to be able to kind of read your audience but with kids you have to get all these main points out super quick and super thoroughly because they don’t have the attention span to just sit and hear the same thing going on and on and on they just have to hear like boom this is what this is Boom this is what this is and you just kind of got to move fast

JACOB: absolutely um I think when people look at teaching kids they see it as something where oh well it’s just like I’ll just go I guess since I’m starting to volunteer I’ll just go teach this kids it’s whatever um but there’s a real genuine value for every person in the church to be able to teach a child because even if they’re not teaching children what you just described is you’re not dumbing it down they just they don’t have the same spiritual vocabulary and they don’t have the same attention span that someone who’s already in a church has that sounds exactly like evangelism yeah having to use words and translate the gospel message into a language that someone who’s not spiritual would understand and doing it in a very very short time frame yeah for sure I mean imagine trying to give a whole for 40 minute sermon to someone while you’re evangelizing and using spiritual language and everything yeah that wouldn’t work out well exactly so I I think you’re right on it there’s a there’s a real a real value to this and even if there wasn’t a value for evangelism there’s still kids who need Jesus oh

EMMA: for sure um but yeah I mean every every Christian should be able to to learn those things and that’s definitely something that’s difficult to learn um and on that same note of something that every Christian should learn um how have you been able to deal with interpersonal conflict with uh volunteers either volunteer to volunteer or volunteer to you thankfully I’m still pretty new to working at the Garden and so if volunteers really have an issue they go to um our director or our coordinator um but now they’re coming more to me it’s more like volunteer and child or child and child so a lot of our volunteers are handled by our coordinator just because she has more experience she’s older than I am I’m only 20 and so there’s like only so much I can do within that respect frame um but I’ve definitely had to deal with a lot of volunteer child and child and child and most of it is volunteers who are they’re so amazing and I don’t want to make it sound like I’m throwing anyone under the bus or like not thankful for the volunteers because they’re so they’re such incredible people but I understand kids they get on your nerves they test your patients it’s it’s definitely difficult to work with them sometimes and especially when you’re having a bad day and a lot of our volunteers are parents and so for them to come a Sunday morning they have to get all their kids ready and out the door which is a whole Spiel in and of itself um but it it can be really sad to see how they can be super Snappy with the kids sometimes um and I mean I understand it’s it’s super easy to do and we all have that that sin nature still where it’s easy to just not be kind all the time um but just reminding them like hey you are you’re here for a reason and you’re here to love these kids and God is seeing that and he is just thankful that you’re working we’re thankful that you’re working in this but just remember like if you need to you can step out like wave me down come out take a deep breath go go get a snack go get a cup of coffee go get some water like let’s just refresh you before we can bring you back into that classroom area um and a lot of it too is like volunteers who don’t have experience with special needs kids and so they don’t know how to accommodate to the kids in their their different needs um and so it just stresses them out and so they just aren’t necessarily kind and understanding and so being able to be like okay like this is what this kid needs right now I can be that I’ll just let the volunteer take a breath and go tend to the rest of the kids while I focus on this child who who needs something different and may have just been hurt by a volunteer

JACOB: for sure I think it was um Spurgeon in his book Come Ye children where he wrote that um a 10-year-old child in the faith and a 50 y old child in the faith are both still children MH in the faith yeah um and like what you’re saying about like conflicts where I wish a volunteer was not mean to the child or I wish the child was not mean to the child um people don’t grow up unless they do yeah people aren’t Sanctified unless they are and so like you learning to to handle conflicts between children um when other people look at that like with the teaching thing then may see oh well you’re just learning to be a babysitter when really you’re you’re learning to dispel conflict that is everywhere because a lot of people you know I don’t want to use the term acting like children but a lot of people don’t learn to deal with those issues until they do

EMMA: exactly and that coming out of it I’m like oh not to be offensive but these adults are acting like 2-year-olds like I’m using the same methods that I use on my three-year-old kids as I am on these like 50 three-year-old adults who are amazing and lovely but that’s that’s what we do is we treat them with love and we just have to stop inappropriate behaviors no matter what the age is and and you’re exactly right and so with with the sanctification of a child and and an adult who’s a new Christian or not really an acting Christian

JACOB: yeah um just learning to to deal with interpersonal problems and and you know someone not being perfect on this side of Eternity is that’s very valuable for sure yeah definitely so on that value uh what are some lessons the Lord has taught you while working there going through Bible College doing an internship being a dorm Steward

EMMA: definitely patience um and in the patience and in the waiting um being able to seek him uh because patience does not come for me and I learned that incredibly quickly I need to rely on him fully for that patience and that was something I learned um taking on the Tuesday night task um basically with that I was the person who would set everything up I would write the curriculum I would help out like get the crafts all set up um and then I would be the one locking up at the end of the night which was super intimidating as like a very new staff member but those kids there’s I don’t know I see them on Sundays I see them on Wednesdays and they’re they’re angels I don’t know what they had Tuesday nights but if they could stop doing what they were and that would be great they were they were monsters um so having patience and just being able to be like okay Lord like you love these kids and because you love them I love them I don’t like them all the time I tolerate them but I love them the way that that you do which is this unconditional like forgiving love and so being able to just remember like okay they are not 20 they are not 40 I just have to wait kind of on their terms for them to be able to calm down and um be able to listen you know and that that was definitely within reason like we still used good classroom management but like I just had to wait you know and that was something that the Lord was teaching me and that um a lot of just compassion because you you don’t know what these kids are walking in with a lot of our Tuesday night kids like they’re just randomly brought to this place like moms are coming in for the very first time and a lot of their parents are just newly saved and so the concept of the Gospel in Jesus is so new to them that just having that compassion and being like okay I got to again be patient with you and love you but it’s like what what has life been like before this because I was brought up in a Christian home so I never got to experience and I’m something for it just like parents who who didn’t know Jesus and so I cannot imagine what a child has to endure with parents who who don’t know Christ or with only mom knowing who the Lord is or whatever that family situation looks like and so just remembering like every person has a testimony and every person has a background and you just have to trust the Lord in that and you have to meet them where they’re at in that moment and you have to just love them unconditionally and just know like hey like you came in and I don’t know what happened before this like even in the car on the walk from the sidewalk to inside like just being willing to just have that compassion that Jesus had where he was willing to just wait on people and to just meet them where they’re at I think those are the two like biggest things um but I mean there’s always been like super small I mean I’m sure they’re not small in the grand scheme of things but they’re just waiting to resurface

JACOB: yeah and that’s definitely a common theme through a lot of all Ministries is you never know where they’re coming from exactly yeah so definitely being aware of that is a really good thing um what are some of the successes that you’ve been able to benefit from

EMMA: definitely those Tuesday nights and just being able to talk to girls for like half an hour 40 minutes about who Jesus was and how we’re supposed to live as Christians and what fruits of the spirit we like want to grow in um connecting with a child is always like it’s the sweetest thing and most rewarding thing ever and especially if that child is is a difficult kid and I’ll admit that the kids are they are difficult sometimes you know and you definitely have have that one kid in every classroom you’re like oh you’re here and I love you but oh boy um and so being able to um just be able to connect with them and kind of hear their background or just be able to love them well like one of my my little 2-year-old guys he would just hide in the house and he would scream at everyone who came into this little place Playhouse and it was it was terrible and so I would try and get him out and he’d be hitting me and biting me and all the things that 2-year-olds do but just just realize like oh it’s it’s actually your nap time and like have him fall asleep just in my arms because he’s just tired of fighting being awake and fighting the people around him like it’s it’s so sweet and too like one of the girls just like will run up to me like Miss I love you and I’m so thankful for you like one of her little girls who who deals with a lot of anxiet he just came up and was like I love you and I’m so thankful you’re here and just being able to hear like you are making an impact on these kids even though you just constantly feel like you’re like nagging them like okay you got to be quiet we got to listen we got to do our homework like like just kind of feel like you’re annoying and kind of burdensome to the kids at times but it’s like they see that you care and they they know that you love them and so being able to have that connection is like it’s the sweetest thing ever for sure what about failures have have there been any failures in Ministry where you’ve been able to grow a lot from those I got I feel like I’m constantly failing in Ministry but it’s also it’s still new to me and so I’m just kind of working out like oh that’s not how you print the coloring sheets and I just wasted a room of paper that’s difficult and expensive um but even just like learning how to and how not to respond to people I feel like could be one of the biggest things whether that be a 2-year-old where you just kind of are annoyed and you’re like okay I should have been a lot Kinder um it’s just random things like that that you just kind of beat yourself up for like I didn’t effectively Show Jesus to like this one person you know and it just it kind of eats away at you because it’s like my job is to Jesus to people and to point people to him and if I’m not doing that effectively then like what’s the reason what’s the purpose you know and so it’s like you just got to go home and you got to check yourself and be in the word um which is difficult and it’s humbling but you have to be home with the work in ministry and sometimes it just takes a moment like that to realize it

JACOB: definitely what there some advice that you’d give yourself um or someone else starting completely fresh no Bible College no internship just going into into this church what’s some advice you’d give

EMMA: find someone to disciple you um definitely make sure you have good Christian Fellowship because we for one we were not made to do things alone we were made relationally and that’s why we long to have a relationship with Christ and why he’s a relational god um but we have to have Christian fellowship and we have to be able to be discipled um remain learnable and teachable you never know everything um so just learning more about childhood development or learning new curriculums or new teaching styles is is super great um be patient and practice patience in in every aspect of life whether that be with your spouse with your own kids with the kids you come in contact with with your friends just be willing to be patient and just pray without ceasing just like Paul commands us too we have to just constantly be in prayer Pray For the Kids pray for the pastor pray for the parents pray for yourself like everyone needs prayer

JACOB: yeah are there any resources that you have been able to use in Ministry that You’ recommend to someone else

EMMA: that’s difficult um definitely if in any way possible if you can get a hold of Bible College lectures or some of the textbooks like Bible College are pretty affordable like the textbooks they make affordable for these broke college students um Purpose Driven youth was one that I I really enjoyed um the Bible in and of itself um teaches you all the things you need to know about life and Ministry um appreciated the New Testament the most in this season um let’s see what else Pinterest is your best friend because that’s where tons of craps come from um and for us at our church we use tons of uh Answers in Genesis and that helps us with our curriculum that’s where our curriculum comes from um but then it’s also just a source that we’re able to go to in case we don’t know one of the irate questions that the kids ask

JACOB: definitely uh is there any resources that you guys like have available to students like in the classrooms or we have um for elementary school students

EMMA: we just have the Bible um but we make sure that our elementary school volunteers are knowledgeable and trustworthy because they the questions kids have are the greatest things ever um just because like that childlike faith is just so amazing because the Bible honestly does not make sense like why was a snake talking in the garden and everyone like all my my kids are like what in the world snakes do not talk what does this even mean or like okay why was Jonah in the belly of a whale how did the walls of Jericho fall and so knowing like having volunteers that are knowledgeable in even just the basic Bible stories so that way they can point the kids to like oh like let’s check out what the Book of Joshua has to say about that or let’s actually read the story of Jonah um just being able to have volunteers that we trust is a super great resource um for our little kids we have these super sweet story books and it’s called the my awesome God story book Bible or something like that um where it takes tons of passages in the Bible and makes them all kid-friendly but it also takes um like how we how should we study the Bible how should we take care of our Bible like is that even important like how should we think about it and so these are great and they’ve kind of like opened my eyes to different things where it’s like oh that is an important thing that I like know because I’ve been studying this for the past three years but it’s like oh I should bring this up to people because it’s something that needs to be taught

JACOB: definitely so from everything that you’ve just told me children’s ministry really seems like something that everyone in the church can benefit from because you’re you’re learning to contextualize the gospel to people who don’t know spiritual language don’t know the Bible stories um you’re learning to disciple people and and care for people you’re learning to be around people who are children in sanctification um yeah so it it really sounds like children’s ministry is something that that everyone in the church can benefit from it it definitely is and I would say if you can be around kids and not lose your every loving mind try it out at least for one month like you you got to give it a DEC recent trial run because the things the kids will teach you but you know it’s like the Lord using the kids to teach you um is the most amazing thing ever and it it grows you and it humbles you incredibly quickly but it is the most fruitful thing I have ever experienced definitely well Emma I don’t have any more questions do you have anything else you’d like to say I don’t thanks for asking all right well thank you very much for doing this interview

EMMA: of course thank you